STF-2 setup

[LisaM]

Just hooked up the STF-2 to my Denon 3200 receiver and calibrated using a Radio Shack sound meter. I think I did it correctly but I have one or two questions:

1. I set the speakers to small and the subwoofer to Yes.
2. I turned the volume knob on the back of the sub to 9:00 (a bit more than minimum) and used the test tones to get the volume of each speaker to 0 on the meter. I then increased the subwoofer volume on the receiver (via the test tones) by 3 additional db. I did not touch the volume knob on the sub again.
3. I have not touched the crossover or phase levels. Left them as they were set out of the box.

My receiver has a setting for LFE Trim. It is currently set to 0 db. What should it be set at? There is no explanation in the receiver manual for determining if this number should drop. It cannot be increased.

I live in an apartment in NYC and have to keep the sub at a very reasonable level. How high should the volume knob on the back of the sub be turned for normal use? I want to be able to hear the bass in a movie but I don't want it to be boomy or annoying to the neighbors.

Should I be doing anything else to correctly set up the STF-2?

Thanks in advance...

[wid]

Lisa,

It sounds as if you have done your homework.Everything you have done seems correct.

I have not touched the crossover or phase levels. Left them as they were set out of the box.

This would be my only sugesstion.Check and make sure the crossover is set to out and the the phase switch is at 0.Ya never know what happens during shipping.

Also let us know how ya like your new sub.

[LisaM]

Good catch. The crossover was set to In and 90. Phase was at 0. I moved the crossover back to Out. I am going to try moving the sub to one other location tomorrow - in a corner facing the listening position. Right now, it is on a side wall but it sounds a bit boomy. This is my first sub so I am really trying to figure out what it is supposed to sound like.

[wid]

Lisa,

You can fill ot this Form (http://www.hsuresearch.com/support/index.php?id=36)and Dr. Hsu will give you his advice on where the best placement for your sub will be.

[cschang]

If you use the form, it might take a bit for Dr. Hsu to get back to you....he is busy at CES.

[LisaM]

Dr. Hsu did get back to me and "okayed" the corner placement. I am still playing with the volume levels to make sure I get enough bass without it being too boomy.

One suggestion I am trying out (from the instructions which were enclosed with the sub) is setting the crossover to In and the crossover frequency to 90. The instructions mentioned that this might help a boomy sub.

[cschang]

Lisa...how far from the walls do you have the sub?

[LisaM]

7 inches from the back wall and 5 inches from the side wall.

[cschang]

Trying moving it around a few more inches away from the walls if you can in either direction. Sometimes that can make a big difference.

[Lwang]

If you live in a roach motel, you might want to place the sub very very close to the listening position, which would allow you to have a much lower absolute volume level. This way your downstairs neighbor won't be poking their broomstick at their ceiling everytime Brigette Jones Diary LFE edition is being played, or worse yet, make a complaint to the slumlord, who would have to summon the super from the free apt he got next to the boiler room in the dungeon and key in through the 7 locks you have on your door in order for him to shut the thing down (and have him eat whatever food that's lying around in which the roaches hasn't yet finished up).

[cschang]

Geez...I hope you were trying to be funny.

[wid]

Lets hope.

[LisaM]

Curtis: I moved it so now there are about 10 inches from the back wall and 6 inches from the side wall (which is the max I can go for now). In addition, I changed the crossover back to OUT.

A few questions:

When I calibrated it, I had the volume knob set to 9:00. If I want to increase the volume during a particular dvd, should I turn up the knob on the back of the sub or should I go into the receiver's setup and change the db level for the sub?

I calibrated it using the Radio Shack analog meter with the dial turned to 70. Should I have used 80 instead? I read in one thread that, if calibrated at 70, I should add 1.5 db to the sub's level to compensate for the sound meter's inaccuracies. Is this correct?

When I watch HD or digital cable, I notice that the sub is turning on and can sometimes hear sounds as if a train is running through. Does this mean that I have it up too high?

Have not watched an action movie yet. Plan to do so tonight.

Thanks in advance for any help...

[cschang]

Where is the receiver's sub volume set? What test tones are you using to calibrate? Avia or DVE?

[LisaM]

The sub's volume knob is set at 9:00. I have been using the test tones in my Denon receiver to calibrate.

[cschang]

But what about the sub's volume at the receiver? Not the volume knob on the sub.

[LisaM]

After the calibration with the test tones, the sub is at -5db. (I think that this the number you are looking for.)

[cschang]

OK....try turning the sub volume on the sub down...and on the receiver up.

[LisaM]

Any suggestions as to how much to turn the sub knob down and the receiver volume up? (I lent out my sound meter and will have it back tomorrow.)

I turned the sub volume up to -3db and turned down the knob by about 1/2 (between 9 and min).

[Lwang]

Of course I was trying to be funny, didn't I have this dicussion with the other New Yorker about placement of subs in an apartment, and nearfield placement came up? I think there was this downfiring and sidefiring with regards to more vibration for the downstairs neighbor and there was an misunderstanding that bass eminates from the sub like a hammer coming out of the sub hammering on the floor versus it as a buildup of pressure wave.

Anyway, I've heard plenty of instances of subs coming from upstairs (mostly those junk subs that just creates alot of annoying boom instead of shaking the asbestos off the ceiling or cracking those gas pipes that makes those bldgs a death trap.). Nearfield placement is the absolute best idea because the closer the sub is to the listener, the lower the level it has to be while still being perceived as the same level. Best thing would be to put some paddings on it and turn it into the listening chair. Forget the corner.

[cschang]

Lisa....I would try to get it to where on the receiver end it is +2 to 4dB, and then adjust the sub accordingly.

I was just guessing the subs volume control is not linear, and at 9 o'clock, it may be over driving the sub. After looking at my sub...I think it was a bad guess...because at 9 o'clock...that is not even a quarter turn.

Anyways...how does it sound now? How does your room sound withe sub off and the speakers set to large? What kind of speakers are they?

[LisaM]

I left the sub knob at a touch below 9 and bumped the receiver to +2. I have NHT 1.5s for the F,C,L and SuperOnes for the rears. I am going to have to play with the combination of the volume on the sub and the volume on the receiver so that it sounds good but not too boomy. Generally, should I be trying to keep the sub knob at 9-12 or should I keep it closer to Min and increase the receiver's sub volume to +3 or +4?

[cschang]

I put my STF-2 at my Parents', and the sub volume is right around 12 o'clock. My VTF-3 is right around 9 o'clock.

For "trigger" purposes, I have always preferred to boost on the receiver as opposed to the sub.

[LisaM]

Many thanks....I am going to start from scratch again tonight with the sub volume between 9 and 12 and calibrate from there. I found that, if I turn up the sub volume alone, I get an audible hum so I realized that I have to do it in conjunction with adjusting the sub volume on the receiver. (I'm usually pretty good at electronics. Sub calibration is definitely more difficult than I had thought.)

[cschang]

Lisa.....looks like you also have a ground loop hum issue.

[LisaM]

Curtis: I think I figured out what it is. It isn't a ground loop hum. Rather, on digital and HD cable, I am hearing an overemphasis of the background noises in the show. The sub must be emphasizing them. I may have to turn down the sub volume on the receiver when watching anything except an action movie.

I started over and set the sub volume to 11:00, then re-calibrated the speakers and the sub. The sub volume on the receiver is at -7db. For movie watching, I can probably increase it to -5 or -4 db. Over the next few days, I am going to pick up Finding Nemo and watch the Darla tank scene to see how that sounds.

[cschang]

Hope your neighbors don't get upset! :D

[LisaM]

Does the part about overemphasis of background noises on tv shows make any sense to you? When I shut off the sub and put my ear to a speaker, I can hear the noise in the background. The sub just magnifies it.

The sub volume seems to be pretty low, right? I found that I had to keep lowering it in the receiver's volume in order to be calibrated properly.

[cschang]

and it only happens when you are watching cable TV?

If so.....what kind of background noise is it? If it is a hum.....it is still a groundloop I think.

[LisaM]

I don't think it is a ground loop because it isn't really bothersome when I am just watching cable without the sub. However, I have heard it on homemade tapes played back on another vcr, at a higher volume. The background noise is noticible but the sub really accentuates it. I am not going to worry about it...I can always cut the volume of the sub when watching cable and just increase it when watching a movie or listening to a cd. Hopefully, everything will sound perfect when watching a dvd.

[tdekany]

I don't think it is a ground loop because it isn't really bothersome when I am just watching cable without the sub. However, I have heard it on homemade tapes played back on another vcr, at a higher volume. The background noise is noticible but the sub really accentuates it. I am not going to worry about it...I can always cut the volume of the sub when watching cable and just increase it when watching a movie or listening to a cd. Hopefully, everything will sound perfect when watching a dvd.

Lisa - the Radio Shack ground loop isolator for about $15.00 will get rid of it. Give it a try. Worked wonders for one of our systems. The other setup in another house didn't need one. You don't want to keep adjusting the volume. That sucks!

[LisaM]

I am definitely willing to try it and will order one today. Between which components is it hooked up?

[finchna]

I don't know if this might be what you're hearing (especially if it's in home movies), but since adding a sub to my system I hear things in movies (and TV) that I've never heard before. For example, on The Whole 10 Yards (not a film I'd expect to have much sub activity) there was a low rumble for quite a bit of the film. I'd cut the sub and it would go away--kinda odd. I've noticed such rumbles in other films that I only hear with the sub--almost the kind of thing that would make me think that the filmmakers are trying to keep you on edge without you knowing why you're feeling that way. I have noticed similar low rumbling on TV also. Perhaps it's just somethign wacky with my system, but it's not there all the time when watching a variety of types of video (and never on music) which makes me think it's part of the video audio track. Anyone else experience anything like that?

Nathan

[LisaM]

Nathan: this sounds like exactly what I am hearing. With the sub, I hear a low rumble on various cable tv shows (NYPD Blue, Cold Case) that is not really apparent without it unless you put your ear right up against the speaker. I do think it is part of the audio track, which is being magnified by the sub. Have you come up with a solution?

[finchna]

Nathan: this sounds like exactly what I am hearing. With the sub, I hear a low rumble on various cable tv shows (NYPD Blue, Cold Case) that is not really apparent without it unless you put your ear right up against the speaker. I do think it is part of the audio track, which is being magnified by the sub. Have you come up with a solution?

Hi Lisa,

Yeah, that sounds like what I hear. I don't have a solution--I'm interested to read if others do. I suppose I'd not want something that cut off freq response at some low point as I think that would affect both my music and HT (when I want that low frequency response). I also don't want to turn off my sub--so--I've accepted it as a tension-builder kind of thing (or sloppy audio editing by the sound studio that thinks that no one can hear those leftovers).

Nathan

[Lwang]

Over the next few days, I am going to pick up Finding Nemo and watch the Darla tank scene to see how that sounds.I always thought Darla scene is overemphasized. It is nothing but bloated bass with ALOT of overhang. The tubbier a sub is, the better it would sound.

[LisaM]

I would love to find a solution. When I watch normal cable tv with the sub on, there is definitely a low rumble in the background which really shouldn't be there. It is pretty annoying...Anyone have any thoughts?

[cschang]

Have you tried calling the cable company to complain about the background noise?

[LisaM]

It's not bad cable - rather, it is part of the audio track of the tv show. It is accentuated by the sub.

My temporary solution is to turn down the level of the sub at the receiver while watching cable tv. I can turn it back up for a movie.

[tdekany]

It's not bad cable - rather, it is part of the audio track of the tv show. It is accentuated by the sub.

My temporary solution is to turn down the level of the sub at the receiver while watching cable tv. I can turn it back up for a movie.

Can you try the ground loop isolator?

[LisaM]

I think I may have found the source of the problem. Unfortunately, I have an HD cable box. I went into the settings on the box and turned the audio level to 0. I can still watch cable through my component cables but cannot record anything using the svideo inputs since there is no audio on those with the level on the box turned off. However, the nasty background noise (which was accentuated by the sub) appears to be gone. I am going to watch Alias tonight and see if the bass sounds right - without any nasty rumbles.