Photo - ULS-15 in Walnut

[hjones4841]

Is there a photo of the ULS-15 in walnut posted somewhere? I don't see it on the main website. Thanks.

[Pete_Hsu]

Hi hjones,

Here are some pics of the Walnut ULS-15:

http://forum.hsuresearch.com/showpost.php?p=38136&postcount=2

The finish looks much better in person than in the photos too...

Sincerely,

[hjones4841]

Thanks, Pete. Walnut finish on speakers is rare these days. This looks like a reasonable match to my older Klipsch mains.

A question about co-locating. Years ago I remember that locating two woofers next to each other (stacked or side by side) results in more gain than them separated due to acoustic coupling of the cones. Is that correct?

[hometheatergeek]

See my signature and click on link to my Current System. I have a Dual Drive in walnut and boy are they good looking.

[hjones4841]

See my signature and click on link to my Current System. I have a Dual Drive in walnut and boy are they good looking.

Boy, they do look nice. Great choice for the mains, by the way. I have full Heritage - a 1998 pair of K'horns and a Belle up front, a 1978 pair of K'horns in back and a pair of Heresy IIIs on the side walls. Plus LOTS of bass trapping. All that in a 12.5 x 20.5 x 8 room:).

Great sound, but my 11 year old Velodyne FSR-18 cannot keep up with the K'horns output (big surprise there). It does have plenty of LF extension, tho. Kinda thinking about a Dual Drive to help it out. Also looking at the Submersive, but the walnut on the Hsu is very inviting.

[Pete_Hsu]

Hey hjones,

Yes, it is easiest to get highest headroom when you co-locate two subwoofers. That said, in some instances, one can get 5-6db increase in SPL even with the subwoofers separated. In our demo room, where we have one ULS-15 in each back corner of the room, we get a 5-6db increase in SPL across the board.

By the way, I've attached a color chart which shows the differences between our luxury finishes...

Sincerely

[hometheatergeek]

Yep, love the legacy Klipsch. I went ahead and updated the crossovers with X-overs from Bob Crites in the Forte II and you talk about a huge increase in the sparkle from the Highs, the openness of the mid range and the impact of the bass after that update.

I recently heard a dual submersive setup in another AVSforum member's dedicated, treated HT room and yes they sound great. But it did not make me want to change my decision on the Dual Drive. The submersives were not totally dialed in yet and after going home and listening to the same material, I will not be selling my HSUs just yet. There is more about this comparison here: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1162780.

Not all of my observations were posted in that thread so PM me if you want to discuss some more on the phone.

Also see here for my review that I posted: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=16483581#post16483581

[hjones4841]

Thanks for the color chart, Pete. That walnut sure looks a lot like the color of my Klipsches.

Co-locating is possible in some places of the room. Experimentation is the key, of course.

[hjones4841]

There is more about this comparison here: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1162780. (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1162780.)

I actually read most of that thread over the weekend. Dual Submersives are more $s than I care to invest. I would likely go for Quad Drives for that price anyway.

I looked at ED and Epik - liked the idea of the Conquest, but it is gone, at least for now. Gotta believe that I would prefer sealed, since I have been living with the sealed Velo for 11 years.

The old Velo is enough for about 90% of the time (100% of the time when the wife is in the room :mad: ). But there are times when I hear it limiting - the mains get louder but the sub does not. That is what is driving the desire for more LFE headroom.

[hometheatergeek]

So do you listen to music (50%) as much as you watch a movie (50%)? If so then a sealed design is the way you probably want to go.

Will you be also using the Velodyne if you get the Dual Drive? If so you will be able to cut back a little on the Velo gain and the Dual Drive will help fill out the bass spectrum.

You will get the midbass 40 Hz to 120 Hz from the velo and the ULS-15 will help you get the 40 Hz down to at least 16 Hz and also help fill in the 40 Hz to 120 Hz. At least that is what I found with my setup.

Hope you are having fun researching your purchase.

[hjones4841]

So do you listen to music (50%) as much as you watch a movie (50%)?

Actually, the system is almost 100% HT, but that includes Blu Ray concerts. The attraction of the sealed design is that the tight bass of the Velodyne mates well with the horn bass of the mains. I actually thought about getting a second Velo until I priced them now - WHEW!

I run the mains as large with a 40Hz crossover, as set by Audyssey on the Denon AVR. It sets the Velo at a 80Hz crossover. I know the "rules" say set everything to small, but it sounds better this way.

I will keep the Velo. Right now it is between L and C on the front wall and really measures well there - REW shows it +/- 3 db from 15-60Hz at the main seat - BUT it took a lot of trapping to get that. I have a BFD that only has 2 filters set for the sub with neither more than 3-4 db boost or cut - don't remember.

Waterfall in the room started out really bad with no trapping. But now, I have 7 GIK Monster traps, 6 4" ATS first reflection panels, plus the suspended ceiling treated. At the suggestion of Bryan Pape of hometheatershack.com I faced suspended ceiling tiles with poster board (to prevent HF absorption), covered that with burlap cloth, then put R30 above the tiles. Talking about a HUGE difference!!! LFE response and transient response is much improved. Room is a dedicated bat cave - certainly could not get away with that anywhere else in the house:D.

Anyway, for the next few weeks I will keep researching - waiting for a little more $ to come in at the office. Plus birthday and Christmas are coming:o .

[hometheatergeek]

Well Happy Hunting, since that is what we men do. But if you do go with the Dual Drive you would not be disappointed and I can not say enough how well the woodworking craftsmanship on these subs are. This is not the vinyl veneer like the Rythmiks but real wood venner. I have stated this before, it looks like they took a block of walnut and put a speaker and amp in it.

Hope I was helpful. I am not a sales person. I am just a happy camper who made a pleasant discovery when I bought my Dual Drive from HSU.

[hjones4841]

Well Happy Hunting, since that is what we men do.
Thanks for all the info. I think a Dual Drive is the way I will go. I still have to plead my case before The Judge (wife). She usually is a good sport about such, tho. Plus I have a milestone birthday coming up this fall (60 :(). What better gift for an old fella than more LFE:o

[hometheatergeek]

That's actually quite the coincidence. I bought my pair on my birthday. :D :D

[hjones4841]

Hey hjones,

Yes, it is easiest to get highest headroom when you co-locate two subwoofers.

Pete: Is there any preference for side-by-side or one on top of the other? I have 38" below the bottom of the screen, so a vertical stack would just fit.

I did some measurements last night and I actually could do a Quad Drive with a pair stacked vertically either side of center. Would that be insane for a 2050 cu ft room? Guess there would be no problem with headroom:D

[hometheatergeek]

It looks like Pete might be busy so let me try to answer your question.

When I was helping Vivid (forum member and Dual Drive owner) with his setup we tried to stack them. We did not see a better output this way. It was later recommended by Pete not to stack them but to either place them side by side or place them back to back with the amps about 4 inches apart so that one is firing into the room and one firing into the wall.

And yes you would have more than enough headroom :eek: :eek: with Quads but might just be a little to much for the well design room you already have. You could try a Dual Drive first, and within 30 days, you decided on the Quads you are still eligible for the Quad discount. :cool: Cool huh?

[hjones4841]

Thanks for the info, especially about the option to purchase 2 more within 30 days.

My biggest concern when doing my shopping is the possibility of being disappointed in the results. I doubt that would be the problem with 2 and certainly would not be with 4. I am about to convince myself to make the $ investment to make sure I do enough the first time and be done with it.

The problem with some designs is the sheer weight. Take the ED A7-900: 400 lbs. Exactly how is someone supposed to move that thing around? The Submersive is about 150, so that gets into the realm of reason. Moving ULS-15s around, tho, is a one person job.

[hjones4841]

I am about to convince myself to make the $ investment to make sure I do enough the first time and be done with it.

Well, it is done - Quad Drive in walnut put on order this afternoon.

[Pete_Hsu]

Awesome! Looking forward to reading first impressions, and seeing some pictures too :)

[hjones4841]

Awesome! Looking forward to reading first impressions, and seeing some pictures too :)
Thanks for the great service, Pete. Pleasure doing business with folks that care!

Of course I will be trying various locations in the room. If I co-locate them up front, they will be on a dedicated 20A circuit that currently supplies the Velodyne. Is that OK, or should I pull another circuit?

Also, is there any audible or measureable difference whatsoever between the wireless link and hard wired? My first thoughts are to use wireless to spot the right positions, then hard wire.

[hjones4841]

Awesome! Looking forward to reading first impressions, and seeing some pictures too :)
Pete: Here are front and rear photos of the HT - slightly out of date, they don't show all the bass traps. Velodyne is left of center. There is not enough room to put two side by side between L and C and R and C - that is where the idea came from about stacking them vertically.

I know that plenty of testing will be required to get everything dialed in, but what would you suggest for intial locations? One between L and C, one between R and C and the other two in the back of the room? Or perhaps the other two on the sides of the room near the front? The front and back walls are 12.5' wide and it is 20.5' from front to back.

By the way, I have REW and the ECM-8000 mic and mixer for measurements.

Thanks!

[hometheatergeek]

Every time you walk into that room, you grunt like Tim Allen, don't you? And I would wager even more once the Quads show up. Congrats :D

[hjones4841]

Every time you walk into that room, you grunt like Tim Allen, don't you? And I would wager even more once the Quads show up. Congrats :D
Yep, I think the LFE headroom issue will be solved:). Love Home Improvement also - have 4 seasons on DVD.

[Pete_Hsu]

Harry, since you have such large and powerful main speakers, and limited width to accomodate four subs, then I suggest having two stacks of ULS-15's on each side of the center channel, with the ULS's crossed over at ~50-60Hz. Crossing them over this low should help to reduce the floor bounce effect.

The sound quality should be the same when comparing wireless to wired modes, provided that there is no wireless interference. When using the wireless transmitter, I recommend feeding both left and right rca inputs on the transmitter to get the proper level of gain. If you use the wired connection, then you only need to feed either left or right rca input on each subwoofer.

With this many subs, it may not hurt to pull another circuit, although you can always try the dedicated 20A circuit first.

Thanks for the kind words, great setup you have there!

Sincerely,

[hjones4841]

Thanks, Pete. That will be the easiest location to try since the power and sub cables are already there.

I just read Welti's paper on multiple subs and that location is one of the recommended ones, along with putting one pair there and one pair in the same location on the rear wall. He mentions corner placement, but that would put them well out into the room for my setup.

By the way, his paper recommends 4 subs as optimum for dealing with room modes (a good selling point for the Quads), but 2 are almost as good.

[Pete_Hsu]

Harry, do you actually have space in the back of your room to put subwoofers?

Thanks

[hjones4841]

Harry, do you actually have space in the back of your room to put subwoofers?

Thanks

Sorta. You can see in the picture that I have the corner horns on the back wall along with a fireplace. They could go on the side walls about 4 feet out from the corner (16 feet or so from the front wall) or in front of the back speakers - not exactly in the corner. They won't fit between the back speakers and the fireplace without putting them on the fireplace hearth - up about 10" or so off the floor.

[Pete_Hsu]

For simplicity sake, I would just put the four subs up front. Not only will this aesthetically look good in your setup, but both stacks of subs will be equidistant from your main listening position (so you can accurately set the subwoofer distance setting on the receiver to get the proper delay).

Sincerely,