Audyssey holding Hulk down me no like

[greenhorn]

Say guys, I just watched my blu-ray of Hulk 2008 today after calibrating my sub with Audyssey multi on my Integra Dtr7.8. Is it just me or does it seem as though Audyssey sets the bass too low? I noticed LFE in the movie but not to the extent you guys seemed to enjoy, and I know it was there. I'm told that I'm just not used to the blending of bass that Audyssey brings but I rather like calibrating with the Radio SPL to 75db on speakers & say 78 to 80 db on the sub. If I change the trim level of the sub manually will that negate the eq-ing and other settings Audyssey does? When Hulk SMASH! through the rooftoop I want it to feel like it's my bedroom floor.:D he's green:p
http://forum.hsuresearch.com/images/misc/progress.gif

[Pete_Hsu]

greenhorn, what is the subwoofer channel level set at? Have you tried listening to the system without Audyssey?

Thanks

[greenhorn]

greenhorn, what is the subwoofer channel level set at? Have you tried listening to the system without Audyssey?

Thanks
So nice of you to respond Pete, thanks. Actually I've calibrated the system several times over the last 2 or so months. Once I calibrated with Audyssey with the gain set @ 9:00 this last time I tried 10:00. These settings having learned them from my correspondence and readings on the forum and elsewhere. I guess I'm looking for the impact that I feel when I calibrate with the Radio Shack SPL meter all channels @75db & the sub @ around 78 to 80. I realize the meter is notoriously inaccurate in the low frequencies, but I figure I'm close enough. It seems as though Audyssey is the culprit because if I calibrate with SPL & put all channels @ 75 db & the sub @78 to 80 I get a more visceral feel in my <1400 cu. ft. room. Btw. just in case I misunderstood what you meant by channel level my receiver/trim level is set by Audyssey @-12.5. Thanks, Pete. Jerry. I have operated the system without Audyssey and enjoy it but who am I to say(?); some that probably know more about audio thing than me say I just need to "get used" to something other than 1 note bass whatever that means. I'd like to keep the Audyssey if it's as good as everyone says. If for nothing else than it's equalizing.

[Pete_Hsu]

Thanks for the clarification, greenhorn. When I said subwoofer channel level, I didn't mean the master receiver/trim level, but rather the level for the subwoofer channel. Somewhere in the speaker setup menu, there should be a section which lets you set channel level for front left/right, front center, rear left/right, and subwoofer channels.

If you prefer the sound with Audyssey off, then by all means turn it off, irrespective of what other people tell you to do. What sounds best to you is the most important thing! Also note that our ears do become less sensitive at lower frequencies, so some people do like to run the subwoofer a bit "hot" relative to their main speakers in order to get more bass impact.

Sincerely,

[kmitchell]

Greenhorn,

I have my sub nearfield so Audyssey always sets my sub channel way too low for my tastes. My method has been to calibrate with Audyssey and then go back and calibrate the sub channel level using the HSU Test CD and an SPL meter. In general I've found that I have to increase the sub channel level anywhere from 3 to 5dB from what Audyssey sets it to in order to get it calibrated to the test CD.

Hope this helps,
Ken

[greenhorn]

Thanks to both Pete and Ken. Maybe I'll "bump" up my "trim" level on my sub 3-5 db "hot". I can see the value in what Audyssey does I'm just not sure if I like the end result. I just didn't want to ruin the Eq-ing and what not that Audyssey does that may provide a benefit in my room. But really what's the benefit if I don't like it? Well from what I understand about Audyssey I can bump up the trim on the sub if I wish and after hearing Pete and Ken's thoughts' I think I'll try that. Thanks again guys much obliged, Jerry.

[bsoko]

Thanks to both Pete and Ken. Maybe I'll "bump" up my "trim" level on my sub 3-5 db "hot". I can see the value in what Audyssey does I'm just not sure if I like the end result. I just didn't want to ruin the Eq-ing and what not that Audyssey does that may provide a benefit in my room. But really what's the benefit if I don't like it? Well from what I understand about Audyssey I can bump up the trim on the sub if I wish and after hearing Pete and Ken's thoughts' I think I'll try that. Thanks again guys much obliged, Jerry.

Not the TRIM level, but the sub pink tone level in the reciever speaker channel adjustment. It is okay to up it 3 to 5 db just watch out that the voices don't get too much bass sound.

Bill

[greenhorn]

Not the TRIM level, but the sub pink tone level in the reciever speaker channel adjustment. It is okay to up it 3 to 5 db just watch out that the voices don't get too much bass sound.

Bill
I thought that "trim" level was the definition of the level of the pink/white noise that's adjustable in a receiver's speaker set up menu to set channel levels? :confused: I'll have to do more brushing up on my knowledge of jargon as it applies to this hobby. Thanks for the advice Bill. :) Jerry.

[playdirty714]

It sounds almost as if Greenhorn was in the same boat as me for the past week. Audysey wasn't working for me to the sound I liked on my Denon avr889 so I manually adjusted it. Now it's perfect to my liking and when Hulk walks or runs, my house is the epicenter of a 3.0 earthquake. Surpirsed the neighbors have not complained but then again I don't crank up the HT audio after 10pm.

Greenhorn, make sure your receiver displays all channels light up on both sides of the display. FL,Center,FR,LFE,SL,SB needs to light up on the LCD display of the receiver on BOTH SIDES. You can also turn up the TONE configurations in your receiver to higher bass.

[greenhorn]

It sounds almost as if Greenhorn was in the same boat as me for the past week. Audysey wasn't working for me to the sound I liked on my Denon avr889 so I manually adjusted it. Now it's perfect to my liking and when Hulk walks or runs, my house is the epicenter of a 3.0 earthquake. Surpirsed the neighbors have not complained but then again I don't crank up the HT audio after 10pm.

Greenhorn, make sure your receiver displays all channels light up on both sides of the display. FL,Center,FR,LFE,SL,SB needs to light up on the LCD display of the receiver on BOTH SIDES. You can also turn up the TONE configurations in your receiver to higher bass.

Thanks for the reply dirty. I'm not sure what you mean by channels on both sides of the display probably just a design difference between my Integra and your Denon. But I do believe I understand your description to mean make sure all my speakers are working. I have a similar set up on the Integra for that the speakers are acknowledged with a lighted box around them. It's just that they are all on one side together on the osd of the Integra. I won't have SB light up my set up is still 5.1. Although SBL & SBR light up during Vacancy movie from my LG Bh200, but that's another thread:) . I'm glad to know bumping up my trim levels won't affect my Audyssey settings, others have told me that as well. Thanks.

[Ddavidson]

Meters and Eqs get you into the ball park of having a balanced setup, but just like adding salt and pepper to food our tastes and expectations are all very much individual.

Ive always found too many people love procrastinating on about the perfect theory of audio reproduction, yet these same graph junkies have lost site of why people actually buy sound reproduction gear (personal enjoyment).

What sounds best to you is just that "Best" this is regardless of the theory book agreeing or disagreeing with your preferences.

Ddavidson

[cacihome]

+1
Totally agree Ddavidson, thx for putting that into perspective...

[greenhorn]

Thanks to Ddavidson and cacihome for the advice. It's refreshing to hear veterans of this forum expressing what probably brings all of us to enjoy this hobby so much, how the audio sounds to our own ears. It's difficult for a newb like myself to often time to weed through all of the graphs and science that is presented for scrutiny. To know whether or not your getting it right. It's nice to hear some knowledgeable people saying that that isn't the end all to be all. Thanks, Jerry.

[cacihome]

Well Ddavidson is the true veteran here.
I just try to help with what I have learned from veterans like him... HAHA

As Ddavidson said, always try to get the most out of your system, but since everyone has different tastes at the end, pick the method, when calibrating, that you preferred.

There will be lots of people in the forum saying this vs that...My experience is that almost everyone that say "this is better than that because the reviewer X measured it", are even more lost than you/us...

One thing is for sure....If you are in this forum you are in good hands and in the right path...

WOw that sounded like Starwars or so...HAHAHHA

[greenhorn]

Well Ddavidson is the true veteran here.
I just try to help with what I have learned from veterans like him... HAHA

As Ddavidson said, always try to get the most out of your system, but since everyone has different tastes at the end, pick the method, when calibrating, that you preferred.

There will be lots of people in the forum saying this vs that...My experience is that almost everyone that say "this is better than that because the reviewer X measured it", are even more lost than you/us...

One thing is for sure....If you are in this forum you are in good hands and in the right path...

WOw that sounded like Starwars or so...HAHAHHA

Thank you for the supportive words Cacimar, they're much appreciated. Btw. I recently raised the front, left and center x-over on my speakers from the often recommened 80 hz to 90hz and the bass seems to have much more presence from the sub itself.:) I'm not sure if it's authentic or wishful thinking but it sure sounded authentic! That did sound Starwars-esque, heard there was some bass in those movies:D . Jerry

[cacihome]

Thanks for the compliments!

Yeah, Star wars 2 has the most bassy soundtrack of the series, I think.
Your x-over at 90hz should be fine...

Have fun with your sub!

[greenhorn]

Thanks for the compliments!

Yeah, Star wars 2 has the most bassy soundtrack of the series, I think.
Your x-over at 90hz should be fine...

Have fun with your sub!

I heard about the "pod" scene but have yet to watch it on this new system of mine. I'll have to check out vol. 2 unless that's the movie the scene appears on(you can tell I'm not that familiar with the series). The 90 Hz thing did seem to make a difference, I'm thinking of bumping it even higher to maybe match the "lpf of lfe" of 120Hz. That's what I have designated in my receiver controls on my Integra Dtr 7.8.

Any thoughts with setting the x-over higher than 90Hz? I have Monitor Audio Radius series 250's on wall plasma speakers they're big for what they are but the woofers are probably only 3". I thought that's what made the difference in the x-over setting, the specs say they can handle down to 50 Hz but with 3" woofers should I even get close to 50Hz?

[Pete_Hsu]

My co-worker will be purchasing Hulk soon, so we'll let you know how it sounds in the demo room :)

We just added a Samsung Blu Ray player, and the sound quality seems to be noticeably better compared to the Playstation 3 when using our DTS-HD sampler disc.

[cacihome]

My co-worker will be purchasing Hulk soon, so we'll let you know how it sounds in the demo room :)

We just added a Samsung Blu Ray player, and the sound quality seems to be noticeably better compared to the Playstation 3 when using our DTS-HD sampler disc.

HAHAHAH
NICE.NICE.
Definately improvements in audio happen when using a player that can bitstream the raw audio.

Have fun guys!!!!

[greenhorn]

My co-worker will be purchasing Hulk soon, so we'll let you know how it sounds in the demo room :)

We just added a Samsung Blu Ray player, and the sound quality seems to be noticeably better compared to the Playstation 3 when using our DTS-HD sampler disc.

Looking forward to that Pete! Demo room huh, cool. :) I imagine that obviously everything in there is properly designed for maximum SQ. :D I watched my Hulk in DTS-HD master audio as well. My LG BH200 bitstreams in what they call Primary Pass thru. I allow my Integra Dtr7.8 to do the decoding. I'll definitely have to check back (to this thread I presume?), to get your thoughts. Jerry.

[cacihome]

Jerry,

Sorry I read it now...HEHE
Yeah, I was talking about StarWars II...
The Incredible Hulk in Bluray is definately one of the best soundtracks available for movie experience.Chek it out...

[Pete_Hsu]

HAHAHAH
NICE.NICE.
Definately improvements in audio happen when using a player that can bitstream the raw audio.

Have fun guys!!!!

Cacimar, we have you to thank for pushing us in the right direction towards getting a better Blu Ray player :)

[Pete_Hsu]

Looking forward to that Pete! Demo room huh, cool. :) I imagine that obviously everything in there is properly designed for maximum SQ. :D I watched my Hulk in DTS-HD master audio as well. My LG BH200 bitstreams in what they call Primary Pass thru. I allow my Integra Dtr7.8 to do the decoding. I'll definitely have to check back (to this thread I presume?), to get your thoughts. Jerry.

Maximum sound quality and maximum impact too :)

[cacihome]

Cacimar, we have you to thank for pushing us in the right direction towards getting a better Blu Ray player :)

Oh well... I feel honored man!!!HEHEEH It was nothing.
Thanks to you at HSU for all the great service I have always had from you!

[cacihome]

My friend has the HB-1 and HC-1 MK2, with that player....
When we tested your speakers with it, I was very very impressed with them. The HB sounded a lot richer/crisper with it....
To everyone that has a PS3...it is an excellent media center and gaming console...But the stand alone players work best if you are searching for the maximum sound experience you can get....

[greenhorn]

Jerry,

Sorry I read it now...HEHE
Yeah, I was talking about StarWars II...
The Incredible Hulk in Bluray is definately one of the best soundtracks available for movie experience.Chek it out...

Maximum sound quality and maximum impact too :)


Hi Cacimar, Pete. "The Incredible Hulk" 2008 Blu was what I was referring to in the initial offering @ the start of this thread. I guess we all start chit chatting and forget where the dialogue originated.:) That's why I felt Audyssey set the bass too low, yours and others experiences led me to believe I was missing out on the impact of that blu-ray.
I felt the thoughts you had weren't completely subjective becaues your impressions of "Ironman" blu were in line with mine. I didn't think the LFE was that impressive. If I'm wrong about that assesment please correct me.

Max SQ & impact too. Nice!:D

[cacihome]

Ok. Yeah Audyssey sets the sub too low always in my case and preference...I boost it usually about 5-6db's HEHEHEHEHE
The thing with Ironman is that the soundtrack itself/mix, ambience... is not of the very best I have heard...
The LFE was very strong, but the overall detail of the soundtrack was not excellent, especially in the final fight.
However in Hulk...WOW!!!!!
What a soundtrack!... Everything seems to be perfect there, to my taste of course...

[greenhorn]

Ok. Yeah Audyssey sets the sub too low always in my case and preference...I boost it usually about 5-6db's HEHEHEHEHE
The thing with Ironman is that the soundtrack itself/mix, ambience... is not of the very best I have heard...
The LFE was very strong, but the overall detail of the soundtrack was not excellent, especially in the final fight.
However in Hulk...WOW!!!!!
What a soundtrack!... Everything seems to be perfect there, to my taste of course...

5-6 db's :eek: . Given the gear line up you provide with every post you lay down that must sound other worldly! See you say the Ironman LFE was very strong, I hadn't noticed that. I guess I need to "tweek" things.
The reaction you had to the Hulk 2008 movie-that's what I'm looking for. Will keep striving for that kind of elation. Jerry.

[greenhorn]

My friend has the HB-1 and HC-1 MK2, with that player....
When we tested your speakers with it, I was very very impressed with them. The HB sounded a lot richer/crisper with it....
To everyone that has a PS3...it is an excellent media center and gaming console...But the stand alone players work best if you are searching for the maximum sound experience you can get....

That's good to know Cacimar. I debated for awhile as to whether or not to get a stand alone or the Ps3. I'm not a gamer so a standalone was my choice. Everything I read though said the Ps3 was the "best" blu player well I went with a LG BH200 instead in order to "grab" the inexpensive HDDVD's that are available now and I'm glad I did. Jerry.

[cacihome]

greenhorn,

Thanks for the compliments!!

I just have the ULS-15 right now in my HT. It is excellent for my 3,100cufeet room. Sure, I can use more output...but in SQ/extension it is so good....
I really do a mix of calibration between SPL measurements and my personal tastes...But at the end I take my personal tastes above any SPL/graph I trace or see...
The VTF-2 is in my closet, along with the others...It has not been easy for me to integrate all those subs together...I won't try that again, I got tired of trying...(that is when I remeber I have lots to learn HEHHE)
Since the ULS offers the best SQ it stayed in my HT.

[john.]

Just so you know caci, I'm not very happy with your last PM on avs forum!!!!!!! :D :eek:

[cacihome]

HAHAHHAA

Hey guys chek out the new THX logo sound at the beginning of the new Indiana Jones...it even appears to have 16hz pedal tones...

[john.]

I'm gonna have to rent that one. I saw it in theaters, but our local theaters sound systems are nothing to write home about.

[bsoko]

I'm gonna have to rent that one. I saw it in theaters, but our local theaters sound systems are nothing to write home about.

Yah, well the bass in the movie is nothing to write home about. They need to redo it! The bass in Star Wars II is better.

Bill

[john.]

In that case, perhaps its not worth a second viewing.

[bsoko]

In that case, perhaps its not worth a second viewing.

True, but I did buy the BleRay version before all the bad posts.

Bill

[greenhorn]

greenhorn,

Thanks for the compliments!!

I just have the ULS-15 right now in my HT. It is excellent for my 3,100cufeet room. Sure, I can use more output...but in SQ/extension it is so good....
I really do a mix of calibration between SPL measurements and my personal tastes...But at the end I take my personal tastes above any SPL/graph I trace or see...
The VTF-2 is in my closet, along with the others...It has not been easy for me to integrate all those subs together...I won't try that again, I got tired of trying...(that is when I remeber I have lots to learn HEHHE)
Since the ULS offers the best SQ it stayed in my HT.

You had me going there. I thought you had all of those Hsu products doin' work for you in your HT:eek: . I imagine it would be difficult to get them all to play nice with each another.

You say the ULS has the best SQ for HT? That's a 15" monster:D isn't it? I bet that would be a real step up from my 10" sub, and I don't have too much to complain about with the 10" when I bump the gain up on her.:)

I like your style of graphs be da*ned. I maybe put too much "stock" in the science of audio and not enough in the listening to my taste. After all I do have a Radio shack SPL meter and calibrate to 75db's even when I'm not using Audyssey. So at least all of my speakers are on the "same page" level wise.

[jbug]

When you guys talk about the Audessey set-up, is that the same Audessey that's in Onkyo receivers? On another note does is it make a difference which direction the dual ports of my sub are pointed? Should they fire towards a wall or should they not be? It's near field in a corner.

[greenhorn]

When you guys talk about the Audessey set-up, is that the same Audessey that's in Onkyo receivers? On another note does is it make a difference which direction the dual ports of my sub are pointed? Should they fire towards a wall or should they not be? It's near field in a corner.

That's correct jbug. The Audyssey that is being referred to is the one in Onkyo. As a matter of fact, my Integra is a sister receiver to Onkyo, same company. As far as the port question someone else more knowledgable than me should answer that. I have a front firing port. I do know you should keep @ least 3" between the port and the wall if it faces a wall.

[cacihome]

It shouldn't make much difference. But it nevers hurts to try...
as greenhorn said leave at least 3" of clearance...

[jbug]

Thanks Gentlemen. This forum may be slow going, but it's much more pleasant than AVS where you give a movie a review and the next thing you know you are being called names from people who don't even know you.

[cacihome]

Yeah at AVS everyone knows all!!!
HAHAHHAA
It is full with too many experts!!!
HAHHHAHHA