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  #1  
Old November 2nd, 2011, 4:21 PM
mfer mfer is offline
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Sub Recommnedation (I have layout)

Ok, my setup.

60" plasma
Denon AVR 1611 (75wx7)
Polk M10 (ceiling mounted about 1' off wall) I'll most likely move these to the rears eventually but using them for now.

Basement is big and open, but "theater" area is 2166^ft3 (grey).
Have large open areas behind "theater" area totaling 3189^ft3 (orange and yellow)
Here is footprint of basement. The colors just show the cubic feet, there are no internal walls separating them.


Here is pic from back of the couch.


Priority 1 is Sub for HT 90% (10% music). Thinking $600 range. Most likely HSU.
I'm NOT a basshead. I have a kid and one on the way. I just want it to sound good. Could I go less than a VTF-2 MK 4?
Recommendations are appreciated.

I basically want to know if the VTF-2 MK 4 will sound good in this set up or not. Do I need to step up? Basically I don't want to drop $600 if it doesn't sound great. Keep in mind, I don't want a shake down the house sub either.

So....what would you recommend?

Also, where would you place the sub in this case?

TIA.
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  #2  
Old November 3rd, 2011, 11:06 AM
Pete_Hsu Pete_Hsu is offline
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Hi mfer,

Great looking room you have there, thank you for sharing!

You have a large overall volume of space to fill, so I would suggest going with a 12" subwoofer at a minimum. VTF-2 MK4 is certainly a good choice, and if budget is flexible, you can even consider VTF-3 MK4.

How much flexibility do you have in terms of placing the subwoofer? In general, it is best to place the subwoofer as far away from those large openings as possible.

Thanks

Sincerely,
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  #3  
Old November 3rd, 2011, 11:42 AM
mfer mfer is offline
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I'm flexible with the sub placement. This would be the first Sub I ever bought so thanks for the help.

Which would fill the space better?

2x VTF-2 MK4
or
2x VTF-3 MK4
or
1x VTF-15H

Please keep in mind, I don't want to shake the house. Just want good, clean sounds.

Thanks,

-Mik
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  #4  
Old November 4th, 2011, 5:24 AM
mfer mfer is offline
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And by flexible I mean I'll put it anywhere.
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  #5  
Old November 4th, 2011, 2:23 PM
Pete_Hsu Pete_Hsu is offline
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Hi Mik,

All those models will fill the space nicely. Given your space and your listening preferences, and given that you have a large L-shaped couch, I would probably lean towards getting dual 12" subs in order to get the smoothest bass across multiple seats.

Sincerely,
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  #6  
Old November 7th, 2011, 11:12 AM
mfer mfer is offline
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More questions if you may.

Here is my updated thought process.

I'm looking to get the VTF-15H and see how that goes. When I really crank it up, I'll be the only one listening so even sound over entire couch (while nice) isn't critical right off the bat. Depending on how much I love this sub, I may end up getting another in a few months/year. I'm leaning towards this as I love the versitility of pseudo sealed (for rock/punk music) and ported for HT. Also love what I read about this sub being somewhat newb proof and "indestrutible".

So before I place an order...I see you have the HB-1s and HC-1 on sale now.

Center channel would be easy. Put it on the entertainment center and adjust the angle to the listener accordingly.

The left/right seems harder as the fireplace on the left and the block on the right (covers water pipes) protrudes out. Right now I have those Polk's dropped from the ceiling (they are about 12" off the back wall on the left and 4" off the back wall on the right). Not a big deal as they are sealed.

The HB-1's are rear ported and I see you recommend so pretty far off the wall lengths. If the tweeter is 40" off the ground, then the HB-1 needs to be 21" off the wall in the back and 27" off the side wall.

You recommend using the Pinpoint AM-40's. Here is the side layout of them.


I don't see how I'll get anywhere near 21" off that back wall using these mounts. Looks more like I'll only get about 4" off. I'm also not sure I can get them low enough to the ground because of the fireplace as well and I see you suggested turning them up-side-down to get the tweeter horn closer to the ear than the woofer.

So, I guess the question I'm asking is, how do you recommend setting up HB-1's in the front?

Thanks again for taking the time to help out. The customer service is GREATLY appreciated from this newb.
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  #7  
Old November 7th, 2011, 4:22 PM
Pete_Hsu Pete_Hsu is offline
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Hey Mik,

Since you are looking to optimize for one main listening position, and since you have a large volume of space to fill, it definitely does make some sense to start with one very large and powerful subwoofer such as VTF-15H.

Any chance that you can place a pair of HB-1 MK2 on speaker stands (with tweeter close to your ear level when sitting down), located to the immediate left and right hand side of the TV?

Note that the HB-1 MK2 needs a minimum of 1-2 inches of space behind the speaker. So a side-clamping wall mount is acceptable. But for critical 2-channel listening, it is nice to be able to put them on stands and pull them away from side and back walls in order to reduce the amount of reflected sound energy.

Sincerely,
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  #8  
Old November 7th, 2011, 4:44 PM
mfer mfer is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete_Hsu View Post
Hey Mik,

Since you are looking to optimize for one main listening position, and since you have a large volume of space to fill, it definitely does make some sense to start with one very large and powerful subwoofer such as VTF-15H.

Any chance that you can place a pair of HB-1 MK2 on speaker stands (with tweeter close to your ear level when sitting down), located to the immediate left and right hand side of the TV?

Note that the HB-1 MK2 needs a minimum of 1-2 inches of space behind the speaker. So a side-clamping wall mount is acceptable. But for critical 2-channel listening, it is nice to be able to put them on stands and pull them away from side and back walls in order to reduce the amount of reflected sound energy.

Sincerely,
If I put them on stands, then I have to put them very close to the TV (see picture above). I thought it would be better to put them further out, like I have my ceiling mounts, but you are saying it would be better to put them closer to TV at ear level.

Last edited by mfer : November 7th, 2011 at 5:04 PM.
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  #9  
Old November 8th, 2011, 6:43 PM
Pete_Hsu Pete_Hsu is offline
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It's fine for the main speakers to be near the TV. You still have the advantage in terms of placing the tweeter at your ear level, in addition to less reflected sound energy off the ceiling, back, and side walls. If you plan to do serious 2-channel listening, then putting the speakers on stands is the way to go. If you plan to do casual music listening and home theater, then wall mounting is certainly acceptable. Try it both ways if you can.
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  #10  
Old November 8th, 2011, 8:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mfer View Post
I'm looking to get the VTF-15H and see how that goes. When I really crank it up, I'll be the only one listening so even sound over entire couch (while nice) isn't critical right off the bat.
I would like to point out some conventional wisdom: two subs are ALWAYS better than one sub. This is true for two smaller subs vs. one larger sub.

Why? Because subwoofers excite room modes below 300 Hz, so either a single sub or two subs are going to fill your space with sound. However, which room modes get excited depends significantly on sub placement. A single sub will exhibit issues with smooth base response. Two subs allow for placement that will smooth out the base response.

I just thought you might want to consider this before making your choice, and perhaps Pete has some additional thoughts.
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  #11  
Old November 9th, 2011, 6:36 AM
mfer mfer is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JerryMeeker View Post
I would like to point out some conventional wisdom: two subs are ALWAYS better than one sub. This is true for two smaller subs vs. one larger sub.

Why? Because subwoofers excite room modes below 300 Hz, so either a single sub or two subs are going to fill your space with sound. However, which room modes get excited depends significantly on sub placement. A single sub will exhibit issues with smooth base response. Two subs allow for placement that will smooth out the base response.

I just thought you might want to consider this before making your choice, and perhaps Pete has some additional thoughts.
I hear you but I really like the flexibility of the sealed and ported subs. If Dr. Hsu made a VTF-12H, I'd be all over two of those assuming they would be near the $1000ish range.
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  #12  
Old November 9th, 2011, 12:11 PM
mentatgom mentatgom is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mfer View Post
I hear you but I really like the flexibility of the sealed and ported subs. If Dr. Hsu made a VTF-12H, I'd be all over two of those assuming they would be near the $1000ish range.
This is essentially what the new MK4 models of the VTF-2 and VTF-3 are. These both now allow for Sealed and Ported tuning modes. The VTF-2 is currently running $550... just saying .
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