VTF-15H MK2 - HOLY COW!!!

[acepaul]

Ok audio enthusiasts, I just received my VTF-15H MK2 on Saturday and after a very difficult time of lugging it up the stairs (the thing weighs over 100 lbs!) I have set it up in the loft theater and have some initial observations. I plan on writing a full review after spending more time calibrating the system (currently running one port open, EQ 2, Q Control around 0.5)

But my initial response is HOLY COW!!!

I am filling 10,000 cf of space with this thing and the volume knob is only at 1/4. Sure there are some dead spots, but in the 20x20 theater loft area that I care about is filled nicely.

They say the human ear cannot hear below 20 hz but I can certainly feel below 20 hz with the MK2. If I did not have carpet, my couch would walk across the floor during space battles! Why would anybody need two of these things???

So, overall very pleased with the upgrade from the Velodyne CHT-12. There is simply no comparison though I will try in my full review.

Does the low volume knob seem normal? The Denon is set at around -8db for the sw channel.

[Tom C]

My VTF-15H replaced at CHT-12 too and my response was pretty much the same. I love this sub.


I would guess that the average is somewhere around 9-9:30 volume setting for the sub. It’s been a while since I set it, but I think that mine is closer to 8:30. The level of -8 in your Denon means that the volume on the 15H is a little high. Turn in down a little and rerun the auto setup. Ideally you want the sub level in your Denon somewhere between -3 and +3. Also, when you run the auto cal set the sub to Q=0.7, EQ1 and one port open. Afterward you can return it to EQ2, Q=0.5.

[SME]

Actually, I beg to differ. As long as your post-Audyssey calibration level is above -12 dB, you're in good shape. My system sub level is set to -9 so I have a bit of play available if I ever encounter content I think is too hot.

The Denon and Marantz AVRs have limited internal headroom, and by setting the sub level too high, the bass may be clipped on heavy scenes played at or near reference level. The clip point depends on the sub trim, the master volume, and the source level. With the source level set at 0 (as is usually the case) and the master volume at "0", there is just enough headroom for a full-scale digital bass signal in all channels to pass without clipping. The higher the sub trim, the less signal that passes without clipping. This also assumes Audyssey isn't being used as Audyssey reduces available headroom as well.

For what it's worth, other AVRs and processors likely have similar limitations. The worst example I know of is Oppo whose Blu-ray players clip for *any* sub out signal > 115 dB if bass management and analog outputs are used instead of HDMI. Unfortunately, there is no workaround for the Oppos. This problem has been demonstrated with real world content such as the wormhole scene in "Interstellar".

[tjc50]

That large space review is great. I just ordered a vtf15h mk2 for my living room which is open to a dining room kitchen and loft (A-frame home) 21 ft ceiling. Not a huge house but very open. I am coming from a corner loaded psw505. I am really hoping for a drastic jae drop once this beast arrives. Next year I plan to add a 2nd one between my recliner and couch routing a 75ft rca cable through the finished basement will be a task

[Tom C]

Hey SME. How are you doing?
Thanks for the info. +/-3db is what I’ve read mostly, but I know that there are a number of people that go with varying settings for varying reasons. Since I run a Denon what you said interests me. Currently my sub is at -2.5, I don’t go louder that -16 on the master volume (generally -17 or -18) and I use HDMI, so I guess that I’m ok as far as clipping goes. Of course I wouldn’t know clipping if it bit me on the ……
What you said about the Oppo is interesting too. I’ve been thinking about getting one. I have 3 players right now (Panasonic DVD-S77 (DVD and DVD-Audio), Toshiba HD-A2 (HD-DVD) & Panasonic DMP-BDT210 (Blu-ray)). I’d like to trim down to one player and add SACD capability. I don’t use the HD-DVD so it’s not a factor. Since I would be using HDMI, clipping in the Oppo shouldn’t be an issue?

[SME]

You are probably ok with the MV setting and sub trim you use, but if you run Audyssey, particularly with "Dynamic EQ", it's usually good to have as much headroom as possible.

Oppo using HDMI output should be fine. The clipping only happens with analog output and bass management enabled on the Oppo.

[acepaul]

Thanks for all the feedback on the settings. I have settled into the one port eq1 q control .3 for music and .7 for movies. I really enjoy the headroom and extension. I talked to Kevin today and he mentioned that the volume knob is VERY sensitive so a little adjustment goes a long way.

I also have to admit that I just ordered a second MK2.

Since my Denon does not eq the sub, I plan on controlling separate levels, eq and delay with a MiniDSP unit running a 2 way crossover plugin. Once the unit gets here, it will be time to learn how to use REW so I can correct for the room, personal tastes, etc.

I would appreciate feedback from anybody who has been through this process with a dual sub setup.

Why did I order a second one?? Well, to fill in a few nulls in the room, increase headroom at lower frequencies and decrease strain from running the subs at their limit. At least that is what I tell my wife. I just want to be knocked off the sofa every time something blows up!

[lradden]

Originally Posted by acepaul

Thanks for all the feedback on the settings. I have settled into the one port eq1 q control .3 for music and .7 for movies. I really enjoy the headroom and extension. I talked to Kevin today and he mentioned that the volume knob is VERY sensitive so a little adjustment goes a long way.

I also have to admit that I just ordered a second MK2.

Since my Denon does not eq the sub, I plan on controlling separate levels, eq and delay with a MiniDSP unit running a 2 way crossover plugin. Once the unit gets here, it will be time to learn how to use REW so I can correct for the room, personal tastes, etc.

I would appreciate feedback from anybody who has been through this process with a dual sub setup.

Why did I order a second one?? Well, to fill in a few nulls in the room, increase headroom at lower frequencies and decrease strain from running the subs at their limit. At least that is what I tell my wife. I just want to be knocked off the sofa every time something blows up!

Hey welcome to the world of dual subs. I'm also running dual 15H mk2 subs with a MiniDSP with the 2 ways crossover plugin(2.1 Advanced plugin) and REW.

[acepaul]

Originally Posted by lradden

Hey welcome to the world of dual subs. I'm also running dual 15H mk2 subs with a MiniDSP with the 2 ways crossover plugin(2.1 Advanced plugin) and REW.

I chose the 2 way as it seamed the better route for me as I plan on using the MiniDSP to also dial in my dual center channel setup. With a 120" screen, I like having a center below and above, but it just needs a little tweaking to balance the sound/delay.

If you have any setup tips, feel free to share. Did you run with one sub first? Any impressions on the difference between one and two subs? Also, have you tuned both your subs to 1 port eq1? Sorry to bring up so many questions, but it will be rare for me to find somebody with the exact same setup I will be using.